Offscript is American Theatre’s flagship podcast, available wherever you get your podcasts (including Spotify and Apple Podcasts).

On this episode, we talk to Willem Dafoe, who’s just announced the lineup for his second year as head of the Venice Biennale international theatre festival. Last year, for the Biennale’s 50th anniversary, he had a semi-retrospective program that shone a light on his own work with the Wooster Group and with Richard Foreman, and this year, under the theme Alternative or Alter-Native, he has a more international focus. We spoke about his programming, the essential biological qualities of theatre, and Robert Wilson.

Then we welcome Helen Shaw, the new chief theatre critic at The New York Times, and Emily Nussbaum, the new chief theatre critic at The New Yorker, for a rich conversation about the state of criticism, the glass ceilings that have already been broken, and what shows are sticking with them. If you’re wondering about the previous podcast Helen references from 2017, in which she vented her thoughts about the persistent maleness of most theatre criticism, you can find it here. (And the NY Times video she talks about, which hadn’t yet posted at the time of our recording, can be found here.)

You can download the episode here. If you have any feedback or suggestions for Offscript, please reach out to at@tcg.org.